lunghd

This thread was started to carry over a response without hijacking the OP's thread.
From this thread: https://chevroletforum.com/forum/exp...ps-zero-37777/



Hello Amber,

I do thank you for your response. Please understand that I know that you are doing your job and I do appreciate it. Unfortunately; from the experience of others who have posted online (here and elsewhere) plus the inquiries made by myself at the time GM will do NOTHING.

They did nothing for the original owners who complained and will do nothing for those of us who ended up with used fleet vehicles that have these design defects. Take a moment and Google for the intake gasket issue and see how many hits you get... same with the peeling paint issue. GM has a problem that no amount of PR will fix for those of us who have had to pay thousands of dollars to take care of an issue that originates with poor OEM 'quality'.

GM does not publicly acknowledge either of these problems - not the intake gasket failures... not the peeling paint. There are so many vehicles with one (or for some of us lucky folk - both) of these issues that GM would re-bankrupt itself fixing the problem.

I would do the PM thing but frankly - that simply does not help others who have this problem so I will respond here solely in hopes that it does help someone else going through either of these issues. From my prior research I found many forums where others had experienced these problems - in fact; that is how I came to find this helpful forum. Amber, I do appreciate your response but 'showing care & concern' online is plain and simple PR and a far cry from actually taking care of customers... I've already been hosed and not wanting to experience further "GM Quality" I won't be dropping my trousers and walking backwards toward the nearest GM dealership - sorry. Again, I do appreciate your response but if GM were actually going to take care of it's customers they would DO SO WHEN WE SHOWED UP WITH THESE PROBLEMS IN PERSON and not online in an effort to spin up some PR and appear responsive when someone else is googling this problem.

What was the problem in my case? OEM defective intake gaskets. Want to send me a check for the cost of replacing my engine? How about three checks? I'm on my third engine. Yeah, third. And we have had to replace the crank & bearings in this engine so the running joke is it's on engine 3 & 1/2.

Why 3 & 1/2 engines?

The factory defective intake gaskets (a known issue) failed in my original engine (#1)... coolant got into the oil and fried the bearings. We ordered a salvage engine (#2)... guess what? It turned out to have been repaired previously and also had internal damage. Ok... stuff happens. That engine was replaced by the salvage yard's warranty and guess what!? In a few short months the intake gasket failed on the second salvage engine (#3) which again flooded the oil with coolant! Is GM going to take care of that? Compensate me for the lost time while my van was down? Buy me lunch even?

In each case it was the same defective intake gasket that failed. We didn't sneak into the assembly line and force GM to use them... it was a choice during production with components that were intended to fail after the warranty period expired in order to provide activity for the dealership service departments.
How do I know that? I work with a former GM engineer who explained the production component selection process to me as he experienced while working for GM. Engineers provided multiple options for each component pre-production & GM management selected the minimally qualified component for production use - EVEN IF A CHEAPER ALTERNATIVE WOULD PERFORM BETTER. The goal was 'after warranty' service work for the dealership service departments.

Onward to the paint issue. White GM service vans from coast to coast can be found in any Home Depot or Lowe's parking lot and I will bet you dinner that more than a few of them will have peeling paint.

My own hood had been repainted prior to my purchase of the van and I myself have painted over other areas where the factory paint peeled off. Right now I have that commonly peeled area right over the windshield reappearing and showing primer. The same thing happened on the passenger side window frame. For both issues I did NOT go to the dealership... why would I? GM "quality" has hosed me hard enough already & a can of non-GM Krylon covers the issue well enough for a 'work van' although a passenger van owner would rightly be screaming bloody murder.
(In fact there is a thread here on this forum where this has happened: https://chevroletforum.com/forum/exp...ing-off-69815/ )

My repair cost? $4 vs thousands GM would stick me with in a dealership paint shop. If you think I'll ever pay the dealership a nickel for that same can... or to repaint, service or otherwise get into my wallet: That is not going to happen.

So long as I can keep it running with aftermarket parts; I will... but the day it breaks beyond economical repair is the day my Express 3500 will be replaced with a Sprinter or Nissan.

I will never own another GM product.

Ever.

If GM were to - GIVE - me a GM replacement van to replace my current van I would swap it on the spot for a Sprinter or Nissan van.

Again: I will NEVER own another GM product.

Ever.


Thank you for responding, Amber. It is tough being on the customer service end especially when tasked with un-doing the damage that the corporate 'position' has already done to the product reputation. We also know, along with anyone who has read this, that GM will NOT fix these issues for customers in the field. There are simply too many of us out here who have experienced these problems and if one person reports that GM is fixing, or compensating customers for repairing the issue on their vehicle the resulting stampede would overwhelm GM's ability to cope.

There is a helluva lot more I could say but not a lot GM can say. GM won't cut me a check. GM won't address the issue no matter how many folks show up with it. If by some miracle GM mails me a check to cover the cost of replacing my engine (or even one of them) or sends out a coupon for a Happy Meal... I'll still never own another GM product.

Again: Amber I do appreciate that you and others retained to contact us on forums like this are likely quite sincere in your individual efforts... it's just that GM itself isn't sincere and if I can save -1- person from going through what I did with my van then responding to you in this post is worth it.
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Chevrolet Customer Service

lunghd,

I do understand that this situation has left you with a poor reflection of the General Motors brand. Again, I'm truly sorry to learn you feel this way and that we're unable to do more to assist. Please know that at General Motors we've redoubled our efforts on pending product reviews, bringing them forward and resolving them quickly. If it's discovered a recall is warranted in the future you should be notified by mail. Again, our apologies for any inconvenience this has caused, but if you have any concerns moving forward please do not hesitate to send us a message.

All the best,

Amber N.
Chevrolet Customer Care

Rednucleus

Kinda sounds like the answer you would get from a govt agency, doesn't it. Would have been better if she never answered vs replying and removing any doubt on GM's "customer service" position.

dberladyn

At least they are listening and they are here so we all know it. One wrong slip up and the lawyers will have work to do and time to bill for. You know that.

in2pro

I will attest to you having GM's ear when you communicate with the Chevrolet Customer Service folks, you are talking to GM employee's in the corporate office in Detroit...
Chevrolet Customer Service has the ability to open up a dialog with a dealership on your behalf for repairs.
You do have to open up a file with CCS in order for GM to hear your complaint simply stating it in any forum won't do it.

greenfire

They are listening and responding... on a forum.. that's huge for an auto manufacturer.

lunghd

GM is not going to replace engines and prior "Customer Service" taught me that what is said publicly is far, far different that what will happen in the dealership service department.

THAT is the entire reason GM is responding on internet forums. It's far cheaper to pay someone to do online PR than admit the snafu of building failure into product components where hundreds (thousands?) of folks might catch the eye of a sharp lawyer.

I do sincerely appreciate everyone's OPINION... but your opinion does nothing to change my first-hand EXPERIENCE nor does it change the fact that this issue has cost me personally more in repairs than the vehicle itself cost.

I'll add this, although I wasn't going to...

My son's GMC Jimmy 4.3L just experienced the exact same issue with intake gasket failure and coolant leakage into the oil. We thought we had caught it in time... NOT. A few months after having had the gasket leak repaired it spun a bearing requiring a remanufactured engine to be installed in it.

Who paid for that? Damn sure wasn't GM.

Prior to that I had a 4.3L Blazer that I purchased for a song BECAUSE of this same failure. I quickly sold that one after replacing the engine with a salvage motor.

I will NEVER, EVER, own another GM product again.

EVER.

It is a slap in the face for anyone who previously supported and purchased GM... the deliberate failure of intake gaskets was designed into the motor all to boost dealership service department business.

What's the old saying?
"Fool me once - shame on you. Fool me twice... shame on me."

This fool will buy a Sprinter or Nissan next time.
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greenfire

So why didn't you replace all the gaskets when engine number 3 was on the engine stand/ before install? You can't expect GM to warranty salvage engines? Your original engine.. yes, should of been under warranty.. that is if you were the original owner of the van. You bought this van new right? What years were these engines installed? Your van is 15 years old! Do you really think anyone at GM is going to care?


What year is the Jimmy? Its pretty common for head gaskets or intake gaskets to go on ANY older engine. That is usually what finishes them off. I have an old Jeep and check the oil monthly not just for level, but to see what may be in it.


Did you use the same mechanic for all these engines? Certainly a pattern you have there. (I had a mechanic that was leaving certain things loose.. sabotage.. trying to ruin engines to get the bill)


So yes there was a design defect. (On purpose?... You would need a month in court to prove that.) You are dealing with a used van and used engines.. and asking for a recall to save the day? If that's not what you are asking then I don't understand the point of all this drama? To warn others? Of what? The 5.7 has been long out of production for years and I haven't heard of any such problems with the newer engines. Oh and good luck with the Nissan....

tech2

Nothing that is said on this forum will change operations at General motors. hense the generic customer service response.
It's the same for all car makers. They all have pattern failures.