Towing with GM 1 ton extended passenger van (Savana/Express)
August 7th, 2019, 3:10 AM
#11
Your stock shocks should get you at least a year or two of use, just know that several folks on this forum have had to replace theirs in 2-3 years.
I think you'll appreciate the ability to "move about the cabin" on long road trips. I'm not sure about the ages of your kiddos, but my wife really appreciates the ability to stay in the vehicle to help unbuckle kids when the weather is hot/cold/rainy/etc. Speaking of kids... I think I recall reading in another thread that you are getting a slider rear door. I agree with your sentiments about the lack of a power door option and the benefit of not dinging your van or someone's vehicle as the kids throw the rear doors open. We have a slider, and much prefer it to the swing-out doors for a few reasons in addition to those mentioned; however, the door is HEAVY. It's not hard to move for adults and older kids, but little ones might not be able to do it by themselves (close it securely or open it from outside). This problem is worse if you are parked facing down hill (whereas uphill could result in the door "slamming" open when an inattentive child pulls the lever without the awareness that he/she needs to hold on to control the door's rate of movement). Also, the "lock" in the open position is friction based and not a physical latch. We've found that it's good enough for almost every situation we've been in, but the door could dislodge and slide forward on its own when the nose is down-slope. I'm making a big deal out of relatively minor issues to bring awareness to potential dangers. A little oversight while you get used to the van will do a lot for your family's safety.
As for tire options. My environment has not forced me to upgrade the tires, and I plan to wear the tread down significantly before I replace them (but again, no ice/snow where I live in southern AL). Be sure to measure your clearance between the body/wheels and the slider before making changes. There isn't much clearance. Too wide of a tire, the addition of fender flares, or new wheels with the wrong offset could put you in a bind (literally).
I think you'll appreciate the ability to "move about the cabin" on long road trips. I'm not sure about the ages of your kiddos, but my wife really appreciates the ability to stay in the vehicle to help unbuckle kids when the weather is hot/cold/rainy/etc. Speaking of kids... I think I recall reading in another thread that you are getting a slider rear door. I agree with your sentiments about the lack of a power door option and the benefit of not dinging your van or someone's vehicle as the kids throw the rear doors open. We have a slider, and much prefer it to the swing-out doors for a few reasons in addition to those mentioned; however, the door is HEAVY. It's not hard to move for adults and older kids, but little ones might not be able to do it by themselves (close it securely or open it from outside). This problem is worse if you are parked facing down hill (whereas uphill could result in the door "slamming" open when an inattentive child pulls the lever without the awareness that he/she needs to hold on to control the door's rate of movement). Also, the "lock" in the open position is friction based and not a physical latch. We've found that it's good enough for almost every situation we've been in, but the door could dislodge and slide forward on its own when the nose is down-slope. I'm making a big deal out of relatively minor issues to bring awareness to potential dangers. A little oversight while you get used to the van will do a lot for your family's safety.
As for tire options. My environment has not forced me to upgrade the tires, and I plan to wear the tread down significantly before I replace them (but again, no ice/snow where I live in southern AL). Be sure to measure your clearance between the body/wheels and the slider before making changes. There isn't much clearance. Too wide of a tire, the addition of fender flares, or new wheels with the wrong offset could put you in a bind (literally).
As far as tires, if I buy new shoes soon, i can reclaim some of the costs by selling them as take offs. With as many cargo van owners in my area, there is bound to be someone in need of 245/75/16 tires. Theyll have less than 1000 miles and be priced less than half of new. Michelin has always been my "go to" brand as I really do like the reviews and looks of the LTX A/T3s. 60000 mile warranty too.
The new clsss 5 hitch is on the way too. I have a long weekend of getting the shocks, brake controller, and hitch put on as well as doing a trial run with the trailer. Hope it goes smoothly.
Also, do these vans come with 2 sets of keys and FOBs from the factory? I forgot to ask the dealer as I saw an option an add-on option on GMCs build site. If not, can I buy any fob and blank key off ebay and have the dealer cut and program it for me? What's the cheapest method?
August 7th, 2019, 2:16 PM
#13
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You've made an excellent choice for a tow vehicle.There's nothing else out there that can carry loads of people, loads of camping gear, and a big travel trailer. I just got back from a 4000 mile trip from Florida to Maine and back, with 10 people, a dog, and a 6500 lb trailer in tow. It did a fantastic job, even up through some large climbs on I-81 through the Smokies. This was my first big trip in my new (to me) 2014 3500 extended with the 6 liter. Prior to this, I had the same vehicle in 2005 vintage with 186K on the clock which I've towed with all over. A couple of observations/ recommendations:
- The 6L90 tranny does a much better job of towing, although it takes some getting used to coming from the 4L80. I like the manual mode, and found that towing in M5 (locking out 6th) was best. It would run about 2100 RPM at 65 MPH, and downshift into 4th (~2800 RPM) for hills with the cruise set. This was so much better than the older 4 speed, which would sound like a freight train when it shifted from 4th to 3rd. Having the extra ratios is great!
- I would recommend you take a look at the Firestone Transforce HT tires - they wear great, and are quite a bit cheaper than the Michelins. Not sure about snow performance though, being a Floridian.
- I intstalled Bilstein shocks on my 2005, and when I upgraded, moved them to my 2014. Van feels so much more planted and stable with them! Pricey, but worth it!
- Not sure you'll need the air bags to level the rear - I've never had a problem with sag, and I weighed my rig once at 13,600 lbs! (that's fully loaded for travel, people included)
August 7th, 2019, 11:01 PM
#15
From the undertones of my wife, that's pretty much the same situation I'm in (her fear of an unpleasant ride in the back for the kiddos). I told her "kids are meant to bounce, right". Tha got me the ok to do the change out.
August 7th, 2019, 11:14 PM
#16
I would recommend you take a look at the Firestone Transforce HT tires - they wear great, and are quite a bit cheaper than the Michelins. Not sure about snow performance though, being a Floridian.
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Not sure you'll need the air bags to level the rear - I've never had a problem with sag, and I weighed my rig once at 13,600 lbs! (that's fully loaded for travel, people included)
Let us know how your first tow goes - I'm sure it will be amazing!
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Not sure you'll need the air bags to level the rear - I've never had a problem with sag, and I weighed my rig once at 13,600 lbs! (that's fully loaded for travel, people included)
Let us know how your first tow goes - I'm sure it will be amazing!
I most definitely will wait on air bags to see how the rear of the van behaves when my "loaded to go camping" trailer is attached. Next week we'll put it to the test.
I have OEM Firestone Transforce LT tires on my Ram 2500. Barely have 30k miles on them and already close to the wear bar. They slide like the dickens on wet pavement and are underperformers in the snow. Any Michelin tire I've owned has always got close to the tread warranty. The XLT A/T3 are 60k tires in our stock size. More aggressive tread design which will hopefully get me to at least 50k.
August 8th, 2019, 1:14 PM
#17
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I kept an eye on trans temps the whole time with a ScanGuage. I actually bought a Derale 13504 cooler to put on, but ran out of time before the trip, so I stored it in the camper, thinking I'd plumb it in when I got to Maine. Surprisingly, the factory cooler did an admirable job, keeping temps below 200 except for one LONG climb in Virginia, when I was in 3rd gear for what felt like 10 minutes. Both trans and engine temps got to 220, but quickly dropped after reaching the top. I will probably add the cooler when we head out west one of these days.
August 8th, 2019, 5:16 PM
#18
CF Active Member
I kept an eye on trans temps the whole time with a ScanGuage. I actually bought a Derale 13504 cooler to put on, but ran out of time before the trip, so I stored it in the camper, thinking I'd plumb it in when I got to Maine. Surprisingly, the factory cooler did an admirable job, keeping temps below 200 except for one LONG climb in Virginia, when I was in 3rd gear for what felt like 10 minutes. Both trans and engine temps got to 220, but quickly dropped after reaching the top. I will probably add the cooler when we head out west one of these days.
Please report back on your experience after you install the Derale 13504. That's the same xmsn cooler I am looking at for my van, but I plan to install it with a Derale fluid controlled thermostat. I haven't decided if I should plumb it inline with the stock cooler and let the thermostat kick in when the fluid gets too hot or just replace the stock cooler with the 13504. I like the idea of having the thermostat either way so the fluid can get up to temperature in cold months or trips to cold locations. I'm interested in what you decide to do with the 13504 and your experience with it.
What were your usual speeds on your trip? I feel like I'm always in a rush to get somewhere or to get home because we try to maximize our time away from home when camping, which means I tend to drive a little faster on the highway. That, and my van will comfortably do 75+ when I tow my camper (camper tires are speed rated at 87 mph, so that's not a problem). I try to keep it below that, but I also try to maintain a speed that works with the flow of traffic (usually at or just above the speed limit). This could be the reason I'm seeing higher temps on average than you, if you are running slower than me.
August 8th, 2019, 8:09 PM
#19
I feel like I'm always in a rush to get somewhere or to get home because we try to maximize our time away from home when camping, which means I tend to drive a little faster on the highway. That, and my van will comfortably do 75+ when I tow my camper (camper tires are speed rated at 87 mph, so that's not a problem).
Also, it may not be a component failure but a road obstacle, spooked 12 pt buck, or careless teen attempting to respond to the "oh so urgent" text message as her vehicle becomes a kinetic bomb at 75-80 mph. A 14K# rig is much harder to arrest, dodge, and/or control than one 1/3rd the size and weight. Cough that up to smple principles of physics I guess.
My philosophy is that for those using an RV as a central instrument for a vacation, the vacation should begin when the rig pulls out of the driveway. In other words, getting down to brass tacks and as wise RV folks once said, "it's not about the destination, but the journey".
August 9th, 2019, 7:58 AM
#20
CF Active Member
cmj1973,
All great points. Perhaps I portrayed myself in a negative light. My point about the 75+ is that I have had to police myself on the freeway to keep my speed in check because when the speed limit is 70 the traffic is 80+, and I've found that the van will happily drive 75+ when towing. Next thing you know, you are starting to keep up with traffic with a 15k lb rig, and I have to get off the gas. "Faster on the highway" means I tend to keep close to the speed limit, as long as the driving conditions allow for that. I brought up the speed rating for the tires because I think that's something people often overlook, and they try to drive freeway speeds with a tire that's rated for 50mph (and trailer tires are an afterthought for a lot of people). (Just a little self preservation.
)
I was mostly interested if Brody was keeping his rig well below posted speed limits to maintain his xmsn temps.
Thanks for keeping me in check.
All great points. Perhaps I portrayed myself in a negative light. My point about the 75+ is that I have had to police myself on the freeway to keep my speed in check because when the speed limit is 70 the traffic is 80+, and I've found that the van will happily drive 75+ when towing. Next thing you know, you are starting to keep up with traffic with a 15k lb rig, and I have to get off the gas. "Faster on the highway" means I tend to keep close to the speed limit, as long as the driving conditions allow for that. I brought up the speed rating for the tires because I think that's something people often overlook, and they try to drive freeway speeds with a tire that's rated for 50mph (and trailer tires are an afterthought for a lot of people). (Just a little self preservation.
)I was mostly interested if Brody was keeping his rig well below posted speed limits to maintain his xmsn temps.
Thanks for keeping me in check.