ukrkoz

i had this question asked before, and i took for granted advice given. now, that i finally got to it again, i have 2nd thoughts on advice given and just want to reconfirm it, before i bust half transmission case.
so, in it's infinite wisdom(sorry for sarcasm, i am pissed beyond staying polite with how they made it), GM put a gear shifter bracket, bent UNDER the pan, preventing pan from being removed. 2 bolts that hold the bracket in place, are ON THE TOP of transmission, and there is no physical way of getting to them without dropping transmission down. i can slide 2 fingers in and touch them, but that's it.
here's the pics:
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<a href="http://tinypic.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i43.tinypic.com/2uts3tu.jpg" border="0" alt="Image and video hosting by TinyPic"></a><p>
<a href="http://tinypic.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i41.tinypic.com/6o3052.jpg" border="0" alt="Image and video hosting by TinyPic"></a><p>

believe me, i tried.
anyhow, advice was given: OH, YOU JUST BEND THE BRACKET AWAY AND SLIDE PAN RIGHT OFF.
ok, i took it for granted then. but i do have a question now:
it is a solid 3mm steel bracket, bent in 2 different dimensions and attached to ALUMINUM CASE.
1. there's no way to bend it just with fingers or even pliers. i work with metals professionally, and i am aware of what it takes to bend something like this in confined space.
2. say, i get monkey wrench on it and bend. what are the chances of ALUMINUM case not ripping?
3. which way do i bend it? do i bend lower piece, bent towards the pan edge, holding shifter, AWAY from the edge, or i bend the WHOLE bracket away, towards the driveshaft? which i am most sure will rip the bolts out along with the piece of case.
4. as the shifter part is bent at 90 to the bracket, how do i prevent bracket from ripping out of the case?
5. say, i have bending irons at work and i can secure the bracket, while bending the shifter piece away. with shifter cable removed from the bracket, on-steering column shifter does not shift gears right anymore. so, that bracket should be bent back exactly into the same position for it to work. how do we assure this?

here's my question:
can someone who has, actually, DONE IT HIMSELF, be kind enough to explain this, before i mess up transmission, or bend bracket away, then try to bend it back, and it snaps in the process? as stamped metal brackets like this do not like re-bending. stress line right across that 90 degree bend. i broke enough metal bars to know better.

thank you.

ukrkoz

i think, i have the solution


yeah, i found a string of posts from various users on this.

one guy did not remove driveshaft:
Well last night I went out and bought and 'easy out' set and rented some kind of small seal puller that I'm going to try. I will let you guys know how that goes. I'll be quite happy if I can get the stripped bolt off and put this replacment on. Got underneath my buddies 2k2 Sierra yesterday and the shop that he took his to to get the filter changed and a flush stripped his as well. It really seems to be common place. I did not remove the front driveshaft but I thought about it. I just put a piece of leather around the driveshaft and then used a C clamp to draw that bracket all the way over to it. I then had to pull down the pan so I'm not sure how much trouble I'm going to run into when putting it back on.

http://www.gm-trucks.com/forums/inde......c=51855&hl=

so, getting pan down is just half the problem. only one person managed to get the old filter seal out. the rest just went back to using old one.

there was some consensus on "take it to dealer next time". well, around here, "fluid and filter" is $470.

also, i just had an idea. pan has a "lip" on it that is catching on the bracket. nothing will happen to have that lip removed just there. dremel sounds about right for the job. hmm, nothing will happen to have some of that bracket shaved down either.......

Mike Sigmond

This is what the book says to do...



Fluid Pan & Filter

Removal & Installation


4L80E/4L85E


To Remove:

1. Raise and suitably support the vehicle.
2. Place a drain pan under the transmission oil pan. Drain the transmission fluid and install the plug.
   • Tighten the drain plug to 13 lb ft (18 Nm).
3. Support the transmission with a transmission jack.
4. Remove the transmission crossmember.
5. Disconnect the range selector cable end from the transmission range selector lever ball stud. NOTE: It is not necessary to remove the selector cable from the bracket.
6. Remove the transmission range selector cable bracket. Reposition the bracket and cable.
7. Remove the oil pan bolts. NOTE: The transmission oil pan gasket is reusable. Replace as needed.
8. Remove the oil pan and gasket.
9. Remove the magnet from the bottom of the pan, if necessary.
10. Remove the oil filter and neck seal.

To Install:

1. Clean the transmission and the oil pan sealing surfaces with solvent.
2. Install the filter neck seal and filter.
3. Install the oil pan gasket to the pan.
4. Install the magnet into the bottom of the pan, if necessary.
5. Install the oil pan and bolts.
   • Tighten the oil pan bolts to 18 lb ft (24 Nm).
6. Install the transmission range selector cable bracket.
   • Tighten the bolts to 18 lb ft (25 Nm).
7. Connect the range selector cable end to the transmission range selector lever ball stud.
8. Install the transmission crossmember.
   • Tighten the fasteners to 70 lb ft (95 Nm).
9. Install the transmission mount nuts.
   • Tighten the nuts to 30 lb ft (40 Nm).
10. Remove the transmission jack.
11. Lower the vehicle.
12. Fill the transmission to the proper level with DEXRON® III transmission fluid.

therewolf

Here's another way:
1) Purchase the two gallons and the Transmission filter kit from a reliable supplier, just to find the name-brand filter you bought comes with a really crappy gasket.(What the hell, it's only 43.00$,right?)Don't forget the oilpan drain bolt(if your system doesn't have one),liquid wrench, gasket tack, small mirror, and mood leveling medication(this cost extra,BTW)

2) Go to unbolt the cable bracket ukrkoz mentioned,(small mirrors and flashlights help) a little confused for the first two hours because all the VISIBLE bolts under the truck have six-point heads, but the two aforetomentioned out-of-sight bolts have Torx heads with the composition of Velveeta.

3)Strip the bolts. Swear out a warrant on the executives from GM's private parts.(Why should you be the only person in the country who hasn't?) You could try cleaning the grit out of the torx-heads with q-tips dipped in vaseline to get a better seat and grip on the torx heads, but good luck with that. (And are you wondering at the evil genius of the guy who figured out these torx heads would be a catch-all for thousands of miles of road dirt? Pity that guy wasn't concentrating on instilling trust in GM products)

4)Using a flashlight, liquid wrench,a miniature vise grips, mirrors,and a small hammer,gradually over a period of THREE WEEKS extract the old bolts.(If that's what GM and Velveeta want to call them.) This requires liquid wrench every two hours, with a lot of tapping, until you finally manage to turn(CCW,BTW) the bolts out with the mini-vice-grips.

5)Go to the hardware store, match up the METRIC threads on your Veleeta bolts to bolts which have six point heads,vowing all the while to somehow, someday catch a GM Design
Engineer in a dark alley and f%&# him up real bad for the good of mankind. Take the Velveeta bolt replacements home, and pull your tranny pan.

6) Schlop transmission fluid all over the ground because GM, in it's infinite wisdom, just couldn't have possibly considered for a moment to bother installing a drain bolt in the tranny pan.

7) Install a drain bolt in the tranny pan.(D U R !!)

8) Replace the filter, and re-use the OEM gasket with some sealer. Throw away the new gasket, while wondering how much it inflated the price of the kit.

9)Torque the pan bolts to spec being sure to gradually tighten the bolts using a crossing pattern to insure uniform pressure.

10)NOW re-attach the shift-cable bracket, using the SIX POINT BOLTS with metric threads you bought at the hardware store to replace the Velveeta bolts GM arrogantly put there in the first place to make your life difficult.

11) Carefully re-fill the transmission with Dexron III or 5 or 7 or whatever the latest miraculous overpriced travesty of transmission lubrication GM has decided to grace us with this month. Be careful not to overfill, put in the last couple quarts slowly while checking the dipstick regularly.

12)Throw a party. The job which you should have been able to complete with 20$ in less than an hour was stalled for almost a month, and cost you over 65 bucks. While I'm taking my tranquilizers, can ANYBODY tell me how to replace the engine ground strap on these trucks without dropping the entire drive train? I guess GM hadn't counted on anyone keeping their 35000$$ investment for more than 25000 miles...

lukemoore646

i usually just bend the bracket with a pry bar out of the way just enough to remove the pan. Caution to the wind is my middle name. the worst thing you can do is get upset but funny stories about it are much enjoyed. and if you think the auto manufacturers are stupid you should work on semi trucks and farm equipment.

cams 98 silverado

boy ill make sure to watch out for these year trucks. im the one that does the tranny pans in teh pit at my work and well it helps A S#!+ LOAD when i have a big drain pan to let the fluid prop into. want a funny story. you didnt hear it from me... i got to work and manager asks me how i would remove the trans pan on a very nice and clean black blazer. i said its a crossmember. i get a weird look and i told her that the weird blue tall *** lincoln jack we have my my locker is meant for crossmember removal. so i explain that you need to use the jack to support the trans, and remove the bolts that hold the crossmember, then take pan off and change filter/gasket and put back together and so on. well... they think im an idiot and they tell me so, tell me that seems like too much work and oh theyve done it before. but why they ask me? they know i love gm. so... instead they remove the pan and jerk it out from the member, how they got the bolts out is a mystery to me without taking the member off... so... they put the pan back on, realize its hard so they ram it in and put it back on. no leaks and it leaves. comes back. i told them again what to do... so manager jacks the trans up so far the mount seperates from the bolts/metal housing on the trans mount. then take pan off, solenoid uno and dos are toast. electronic connectors torn from sockets. and i told them what to do... 450 dollar repair. company paid for it of course but just goes to show... they called me an idiot. thought you might like the story.

lukemoore646

thats a good one, i love to hear stories about people who should listen but refuse then it comes around and bites them good, it warms my heart

ukrkoz

fellas, appreciate suggestions.
Mike, instructions you posted are worse than those from Haynes. a) there's no trannie crossmember, but exhaust pipe. but it is not in the way too bad; b) it is very easy to type "remove gear shifter bracket bolts". in real life, bolts are hidden up on the top of trannie case. which is not, probably, a major issue on regular trucks. but on 4x4, there's driveshaft right there. best i can do is to slide my fingers up in the gap and touch ONE bolt. can't even find the other one.
so no, nothing easy there. if bracket is not removed, you can't remove the pan, as that damn bend in it holds the pan edge, period. i had it all undone and drained last fall. just to find that that bracket is frigging bastion holding pan in place.
make things better, deeper part of the pan is towards the front, and you always want to drip fluid off the shallower side, as it drips better. well no, that exhaust pipe on the shallow end makes it impossible, so you have to tilt pan on the deep side. which comes with BIG BARABOOM and fluid all over you and 5 feet around everywhere.
oh, did i mention that the drain plug is NON-REMOVABLE? ****** OBVIOUSLY WELDED IT INTO THE PAN OR SOMETHING.
so, yeah, book way is great. i do not give up easy on cars, but this one - i gave up twice.
anyhow, i have a plan.
1. remove driveshaft and see if i can get torx key up on the bolts. it's #40 i was told.
2. if not - pry the bracket over towards driver side. i just really do not want to snap trannie case edge in process. guys say it only needs to be moved about 1/4 inch. after that - get drenched in ATF, get the pan off, GET THE DRAIN PLUG OUT, and replace it with matching size oil pan plug. whoever designed that plug, shallow, soft, and crowned - is personally responsible for GM bankruptcy.

Mike Sigmond

I hear ya, I just posted that from the ARRC database which is the factory methods but they dont have every exact model They did not have the 4x4 model I was looking for. They have good schematics though. I tried, I hope you find the right easy way to get it done, or did you get er done already?

therewolf

The dreadful truth we're all faced with is the manufacturer of your vehicle owns your vehicle for only days till you take possession of it. Sadly, this means we pay them to design defects into the vehicle we can't work around.

Like myself, ukrkoz invested in a vehicle which not only cost a potload of money, but whose designed was dedicated to proprietary GM mechanics and workshops. What really makes my butt itch is they canted all the flat surfaces inside the engine compartment 10 to 15 degrees, so you can't lay a wrench down anywhere, damn their joyless,little, money-grubbing souls.